2.9 oil leak blues

[eversmile]

newbie / novice here.

I have a 1989 bronco ii that has a pretty good oil leak on the front part of the engine. The vehicle sat for a long time when I bought it in Carlsbad NM. I drove it to houston around thanksgiving and it actually runs pretty good. Been reading up on the forums and have tried a couple of things.

Oil splatters all over the front of the engine. Firewall, alternator, air filter box, water hoses, are all soaked. The front suspension is soaked too. The belt closest to the engine has oil on it which is why the alternator is soaked. I replaced the valve cover gaskets, front seal (the one behind harmonic balancer) and pcv valve.

It looks like the o ring on the distributor is not leaking.

I was thinking timing cover but realized that I would probably screw up the oil pan gasket to take it apart.

As far as the pan goes, there is oil around it but I am not certain it is the pan gasket itself.

I am trying to rule out things before I get to the dreaded oil pan and rear main... Any thoughts on what else it could be? BTW, I don't have the means or know how to pull the engine right now.

 

[CarsonChris]

Pulling the engine isn't any more difficult than what you did to change the valve cover gaskets. Since you've done that you have enough expertise to pull an engine. The means may be the problem. Ask some buddies or check on Craigslist. I see cherry pickers for 50$ all the time.

 

[Psychopete]

Pulling the engine isn't any more difficult than what you did to change the valve cover gaskets.

until you get to the exhaust bolts.

 

[RonD]

Pulling the engine for an oil leak is a little over the top, especially if oil is showing up in the front of the engine compartment.

Front of engine with that much spray sure sounds like a front crank seal or timing chain cover.
There are gravity leaks and pressure leaks.
Valve covers and oil pans are gravity leaks, there is a little pressure inside from "blow-by" but not a lot.
But in any case these types of leaks "seep" out, oil isn't pumped out.

Main seals and oil pressure sensor have pressure behind them so can pump out oil.
The timing chain cover can also pump out oil because of its motion inside.

I would remove the belt(s) and spray some engine cleaner around the front of the engine wash it off and then start engine, you can run it a few minutes without water pump, Alt(charge) light will come on.
With your description of the leak it should start dripping on the ground almost immediately, and will give you a good reference point of where it is coming from.

And are you losing motor oil, have you checked the dipstick?
Could it be power steering oil that you are finding on the front of the engine compartment, these run from 600-1200psi so can spray oil quite a ways.
Or even transmission oil from the trans cooler lines going to the rad, 30-60psi so a good spray area is possible

 

[eversmile]

Ron, yep, it's oil leaking for sure. I didn't mention it is a 5 speed and its a 2 wheel drive. It seems like timing cover may be it. I have a tough time thinking the oil could be leaking from the oil pan and it leaking in an upwards direction so that it gets flung around by the harmonic balancer or something else.

I like your idea of taking everything off and cleaning and starting the truck.

I bought a timing cover gasket set, and it had the seal I needed that goes behind the harmonic balancer (is that the front crankshaft seal?) The timing cover gasket was in there but I didn't replace because I was afraid of tearing into the front of the oil pan, that was where I chickened out. There was also some kind of sleeve that I believe goes on the shaft of the crankshaft to help with worn shaft. I may go ahead and throw that on there and do the timing cover and the front of the oil pan gasket.

The oil pan gasket has 2 like L shape pieces and has a seal kinda half circle to make up the front of the oil pan. I am just not clear if I have to loosen the oil pan. I will try to avoid that if at all possible. My guess is that I will have to cut off the exposed oil pan gasket when the timing cover is removed and replace it. Do you guys recommend any rtv type stuff when I reassemble the gasket on the front of the oil pan.

I wont be able to do it right away. For now I will just keep filling up the oil and checking the gas...

thanks again

Arnold

 

[RonD]

Fel-pro has the "sleeve 'n seal" in some gasket sets, you usually only need this if you see(or make) grooves in the crankshaft where seal will be in contact with it.
Removing the old seal is what usually makes those grooves .

Removing the woodruff key can be a bit of an effort but sometimes it comes out easily(just NEVER for me), this only needs to be removed if you will be using the "sleeve 'n seal".

I haven't removed the timing chain cover on a 2.9l, so not sure about how much the oil pan comes into play.

Also not sure if it is worth replacing the chain and tensioner while you are in there, that would be based on current mileage and common replacement times for these engines.

 

[kimcrwbr1]

Another place to look is the intake manifold where the heads meet the block. Kinna a pain to get at but clean the area on both sides of the intake manifold good with gasthen squirt a bead of permatex in the valley between all three and with your finger squish it in the valleys what your trying to do is push enough in the crack to make a plug on the inside. Alot of guys use silicone but the only time I use silicone is on windows!

 

[eversmile]

Thanks for mentioning the intake as something else to look at. Will add to my list of things to do. My plans just got a whole lot better. So this Bronco as i said sat for quite a while and has a ton of little things that need attention. One of the little things just got bigger. I was able to fix one of the power windows but just cleaning the track and some wd 40. The other was missing a nut on the window holder mechanism. The window would just kinda pivot when raising and lowering. I was able to reassemble the window with a nut I found, BUT, in doing so, completely shattered it. Afterwards I realized that I needed a sort of a rubber gasket piece that was lost. It goes between the nut and the window to help spread the force. Ordered a driver side window, hardware, and other stuff on the web. So, gonna have a wet week in Houston and wont be able to get to work on the leak till I fix the window. I have the thing parked in the garage and have a busty week with work and family. BTW wife is thrilled w me blowing cash on this project...

 

[broncogal]

I would try this: Steam Clean the engine real good. Then Change the oil, and spray and wipe down all spots such as pan, heads, bell housing with tranny,timing chain cover, etc.etc.! In other words, every where you can clean and wipe off, do so. Then add new oil, and fluorescent tracer dye, and run it for a day or so. Then at night, or in a dark garage, check it with a black light, and you will see where it is bleeding.(leaking)!

 

[richard booth]

I got the gasket set for head service from jc whitney fel-pro HS9510PT-2 for like 70 bucks and took off the top end and had the heads milled and noticed gasket failure at intake that was due to 147,000 miles and finger tight condition lol, took three days but now it runs great and no more front engine, valve cover leaks.

 

[eversmile]

Thanks Richard. I took my bronco in to the local high school for paint job and its been in there for 2 months now. I have been checking with them and it is looking pretty good. I can't wait to get it back to get my hands dirty again. I hope to post some before and after pictures and hope to figure out what is causing my dang oil leak soon.

 

[eversmile]

I finally got my hands on my oil leak problem. I was never really able to find the source but had a hunch it was around the timing cover gasket or front seal because it seemed like it kept getting flung around by the alternator belt which is the one closest to timing cover. I pulled of the timing cover and had to "shorten" a couple of the bolts on the bottom of the cover that ran into the front of the oil pan because there just wasn't enough clearance to pull the cover out. My harmonic balancer also had grooves on the neck of it and I ended up putting a sleeve on it. I ruined 2 sleeves that came with a gasket kit and bought one with a tool. I talked the guy from the parts store to put it on. The tool made all the difference. So I think my problem was the timing cover gasket front of the oil pan or possibly the grooves on worn balancer was not making a good seal with the front seal. I don't know if i over did it but I put a light coat of the grey RTV on both sides of the gaskets and on all of the bolt heads. I did the same on the water pump gasket. So far it looks like my leak on the front side is fixed. I am not sure if i have a rear main leak but I will monitor it. BTW, I had the local high school do some body work and paint I think and it looks really good. Next on the list, AC doesn't work, windows kinda work, rear window seal shot, power steering leaks, needs tune up, has rear anti-lock indicator stays on, rough idle, dirty matted carpet, weird vibration when taking off, and a cracked dash board. But other than that, the thing runs perfectly HAHA. Thanks again TRS folks!!!

 

[RonD]

Thanks for the update :icon_thumby: