Bronco II issues with starter (getting ideas)

[Nalanthi]

Good evening, y'all and Merry Christmas.

As usual, I pop around here and there to post to get ideas/exhaust what I already know to help me problem solve. Writing about it helps.

I've been enjoying the 4.0 swap for a good two and a half months now, but ran into quite the issue I can't put my finger on. After work last Thursday, my starter ground the flywheel. I put it in neutral and coasted a foot or two before starting and being off on my way. When I got home, I crawled under and found that the bottom bolt on the starter was loose - to which I tightened. The next few starts were rough - sounded quite metallic, but without grinding. Sunday rolls around and the starter did not catch the flywheel at all - sounded like it was catching... something... but not a major grinding sound.

Here's what I know:
I swapped between two starters with the same results. The teeth on both the starter and flywheel are not ground out or missing. The bendix ejects and the starters both test fine - so the starter(s) and the flywheel are not an issue.

The only thing I didn't do yet was check the tranny bolts to make sure the bellhousing was tight - aside from that, there are no obvious signs that one would normally expect...

Any ideas, gents?
Thanks as always.


On a side note, I got 33s rolling on this thing with inch and a half spacers and a bit of fender cutting - didn't want to lift right away due to my fear of rolling, but it doesn't rub one bit - not even on the sway bar. Should post a pic sometime.

 

[Nalanthi]

Update: After making sure all tranny bolts were tight, I checked the starter once more JUST to make sure it was the proper auto starter (it was).

I found that if I cranked the engine by hand a bit, the starter would catch, but in starting was making a metal/screeching sound - not a belt squeal. It was more like something was rubbing. After a few starts, it went back to not catching, so I yanked to the starter once more to check the flywheel to see if the area where the starter was not catching was worn and was surprised to see that it wasn't any more or less worn than any of the other teeth on the rest of the flywheel.

Now I wonder:
with everything being bolted up snug and all parts being what they should be... and all wear on the flywheel indicating that the starter may be undershooting its mark, I wonder if I should cut the shim between the bellhousing and engine block to put the starter closer to the flywheel... OR... has anyone had problems with the starter overshooting the flywheel - if this is even possible?

I'm right there, but I don't trust it enough to drive it anywhere that I'll be killing the engine or even enough to start it without concern of breaking something that is going to put me out of commission for awhile.

Thanks again and Merry Christmas.

 

[adsm08]

Could be a bad bendix not letting the spur gear hit the right active and rest spots.

 

[Nalanthi]

Could be a bad bendix not letting the spur gear hit the right active and rest spots.

Bendix tested fine on two starters... it kicks out with extreme conviction, so I'm not quite convinced I have two bad starters. wondering if it might be a starter angle problem? I read about some people who had to grind washers into a wedge to angle the starter towards the flywheel - which makes sense considering that the whole starter assembly appears to angle away.

Would you recommend attempting this when the stores are open tomorrow and I can get appropriately fitting washers?

Oh, and... thanks for all your wisdom a few months ago with that 4.0 swap. Man, you're a forum treasure.


Here's a good reference for anyone else who may have questions/need information: http://www.bcbroncos.com/ford starters.pdf

 

[adsm08]

I would check all the bolts, make sure the trans is still touching the engine, and then look into starter positioning issues. Ford's don't generally require starter shims to get the right spot. That is a GM thing.

 

[Nalanthi]

Bolts check out ok - got her to noisily crank a few times, then back to just spinning/mild grinding noise.

I triple-confirmed that this is the right flywheel/starter combo.

In regards to positioning, am I missing something? With only two bolts, I'm not sure what I can do aside from attempt to wedge something in there to play with the starter angle...

From what I 'think', it may be barely catching as the relationship between the engine block and starter looks like this ---> |\ (but not so exaggerated). I'd like to see what is said here before I decide to either hack the flywheel cover/engine shim or grind the ears of the starter so that it sits differently.

 

[Nalanthi]

It all adds up now... Flexplate only engages in certain spots, makes nasty sound when it does engage.

Looks like i may be dropping a tranny to discover a busted flexplate.

 

[Nalanthi]

Final word: flexplate. Shitty-quality OEM thing broke at its hub and now I get the privlage of dropping the tranny.