towing in reverse noob question

[jkufen]

I have a buddy that owns an old jeep wrangler and every time he pulls one of us out of a mud hole he does it in reverse. He has snatched me mighty hard a few times in reverse. Wouldn't pulling in reverse put most of the strain on the front axle? Would that increase the likelihood of breaking a front axle? I am wanting to clarify because at the moment my front end has a better hitch than my back end and if i can pull from the front it would save this stress on my rear bumper. I know it is just a noob question but i want to make sure i have the right facts for the future.

 

[adsm08]

The load put on the guts of the axle would depend mostly on terrain and traction. The front axle will only take the brunt of the force if it has the traction to grip and the rear doesn't.

Reverse is usually the lowest gear with the most umpph, so I would guess that is why he is doing it.

 

[wildbill23c]

Reverse is usually more of a direct gear in the transmission and a lower gear ratio than first gear, as a result most serious offroad recovery people know to pull in reverse, plus its easier to see what you are doing by pulling in reverse and being able to easily see what you are trying to recover.

 

[jkufen]

ok so if I was pulling on flat muddy terrain it isn't too much stress on the front axles? Like I said I just installed a tow hitch on the front of the truck and at the moment it is stronger than the back bumper. I just don't want to break a front axle. I have been fortunate lately with the abuse that I haven't broke anything yet.

 

[4x4junkie]

Snatching someone out in reverse definitely does put more strain on the front axle. Whether it's enough to break something all depends on the conditions you're doing it under.
I see nothing to worry about if you're on a muddy (slippery) surface.

Also keep in mind, reverse on our trucks is either the same ratio or actually taller than 1st gear. If you want the most pulling power, do it while going forward.

 

[jkufen]

Thats what i needed to know thanks. Ill just keep tugging on the rear bumper until it comes off and then ilk use my front. I am hoping to invest in a winch soon so maybe the snatching will be down to a minimum. My buddy has a dodge 2500 which is 2+ times my weight so when he gets stuck i usually have to snatch him to move his big paper weight. Surprisingly my rear bumper has been tough.

 

[wildbill23c]

The issue you would have with pulling from the front is putting downward pressure on the springs as they aren't as heavy duty as the rear springs. If you are in mud or offroad period, if you pull from the front or rear it don't make a difference for stress as if you are in 4WD and doing a heavy pull you are stressing the drive line and axle components front and rear regardless. Pulling out a vehicle that's much larger than yours or even smaller doesn't exactly put stress on your axles from the pull, its usually the stress related to what people do when pulling someone out, large amounts of throttle application at a very fast rate with that amount of torque you are bound to break things regardless of if you pull from the front or rear. Pulling from the front gives you a better visual of what you are doing is the best reason to pull from the front.

 

[martin]

The way that gears are cut means that there is a degree of force trying to push themselves apart. If the angle of the teeth is the same in both directions then the force that they impart that tries to push themselves apart is equal. however, on a ring and pinion set such as an axle, they are designed with much less of an angle on the normally driven side than the reverse side. In that case the forces trying to push the gears apart is much greater in reverse than forward. With that in mind, I would only do a hard pull in reverse as a last resort.

 

[jamie4ltr]

The way that gears are cut means that there is a degree of force trying to push themselves apart. If the angle of the teeth is the same in both directions then the force that they impart that tries to push themselves apart is equal. however, on a ring and pinion set such as an axle, they are designed with much less of an angle on the normally driven side than the reverse side. In that case the forces trying to push the gears apart is much greater in reverse than forward. With that in mind, I would only do a hard pull in reverse as a last resort.

BINGO!!! I ripped 13 teeth off my rear diff ring gear pulling someone out in reverse! It was a 7.5" diff and I had a 4.0Ltr... Yes you can see what you are doing better pulling in reverse - you get to watch the strap/clevis/tow hook fly into your windshield, personal experience. I've also seen a strap break and a clevis go THROUGH someone's windshield and land on the dash - right in front of his lips. These days if I have to pull someone, with me in reverse, I use the winch - with a jacket over the cable.

 

[Shran]

+2 on what Martin said. I broke a driver side u-joint pulling a guy off a stump like that. I'd only do it as a last resort.

 

[wildbill23c]

Or you could just buy a winch and have the winch hook come through your windshield, or you could pull them from the back and have the tow hook go through their windshield and blow your rear differential. I seriously doubt it makes a difference. Its dangerous no matter how you do it, a stuck 4000 pound truck can create in access of 10,000 pounds of force to recover it depending on how its stuck, terrain, etc. Its dangerous regardless of how you do it, the only thing that helps is common sense and safety measures. Its best to not get stuck LOL.

 

[Spede Demn]

My B2 is pretty much stock except for the 235 tires so I dont go mud boggin with it but seems to me your all missing the simplest solution.... tell your buddies to buy their own damn winch before they go drivin into a mudhole

Seriously tho... you dont want to be lookin out your windshield at a cable snap, sounds like a bad way to end your days.

 

[kimcrwbr1]

Wow someone adding logic to the equaision hummm? Heres the best way I found was to never use a strait pull fwd or rev unless necessary, allways cross up the vehicles. You want the cable rope chain to get tight at about the point you are straight behind the stuck vehicle. You gain alot of leverage plus it puts pressure on the side of the tires on the stuck vehicle, just keep the wheels spinning slow on the stuck vehicle and yank from side to side.

 

[Shran]

Or you could just buy a winch and have the winch hook come through your windshield, or you could pull them from the back and have the tow hook go through their windshield and blow your rear differential. I seriously doubt it makes a difference. Its dangerous no matter how you do it, a stuck 4000 pound truck can create in access of 10,000 pounds of force to recover it depending on how its stuck, terrain, etc. Its dangerous regardless of how you do it, the only thing that helps is common sense and safety measures. Its best to not get stuck LOL.

No kidding, broken cables flying around is about the last thing I want to encounter on the trail.

One thing that's been real popular lately is synthetic winch rope. Almost everyone I wheel with has it and it's totally awesome...if it breaks, it just drops to the ground.

 

[Scrambler82]

BINGO!!! I ripped 13 teeth off my rear diff ring gear pulling someone out in reverse! It was a 7.5" diff and I had a 4.0Ltr... Yes you can see what you are doing better pulling in reverse - you get to watch the strap/clevis/tow hook fly into your windshield, personal experience. I've also seen a strap break and a clevis go THROUGH someone's windshield and land on the dash - right in front of his lips. These days if I have to pull someone, with me in reverse, I use the winch - with a jacket over the cable.

The other thing is, when pulling in reverse, you are pulling on the backside of the gears which are not designed to apply a lot of pressure to.
The gears actually are being forced outward some as pressure is being applied.
When pulling from the rear you are using the flat portion of the gear, the way they were meant to be used.

 

[jkufen]

I figured that pulling in reverse when you snatched and the strap pulled down all the pressure from the momentum of the truck would come down on the front axle and the small d28 cv joints. I dont pull in reverse just because I really dont want to see what the strap is doing I want to see where my truck is going mainly because its usually in a wooded area and I dont want to smack a tree in the middle of the night . But thanks for all the info and the points made.